Ideas for Future Enhancements: Special Teams!

[Carther]

We have a lot of hacks to the offense and defense to make them more dynamic and in some ways more realistic but Special Teams has been neglected. I have been thinking about a lot of things as I have completed my 5 new roms this summer and here is what I have come up with in ideas for future enhancements.

SPECIAL TEAMS IDEAS

1. Kickoff Length Partially based on KA of kicker. With the new Touchback on Kickoffs hack it would seem it would not be too hard to use the KA to help determine kickoff length. High powered kickers (Sebastian Janikowski) could boom kicks out of the enzone for touchbacks while weak kickers (Jason Hanson) would have a hard time making it to the goal line.

2. Field Goals using power bar. In the original Tecmo Bowl Field Goals used the power bar. I liked this much better. The longer the field goal the easier it was to block. AKB could be used for accuracy where a certain percentage of kicks based on AKB would go wide.

3. Punts use moving arrow thingy. Use the moving arrow on punts instead of field goals. This would allow the punts to be angled, maybe AKB could be to allow for a random distance range based on rating.

3a. Allow punts to be angled out of bounds.

3b. Use one of the A B buttons to be able to call a fair catch on a punt.

4. Make onside kick recovery based on the actual nfl recovery rate of @ 15%. When kicked a random number of some sort wouild be generated with 15% of results making it so that the first kicking team player to touch the ball would recover, while 85% of the results would make it so that the 1st receiving team player to touch the ball would recover.

Any comments/discussion/ridicule on the feasability or desirabilty of any of these ideas will be greatly encouraged and appreciated.

[Bodom]

Now we're talking! I had some similar ideas a few years ago, but nothing ever came of it. And personally, I don't know how to hack the ROM to make any of this happen.

My comments below.

1. Kickoff Length Partially based on KA of kicker. With the new Touchback on Kickoffs hack it would seem it would not be too hard to use the KA to help determine kickoff length. High powered kickers (Sebastian Janikowski) could boom kicks out of the enzone for touchbacks while weak kickers (Jason Hanson) would have a hard time making it to the goal line.

I don't know if I would vary the kickoff length based on the kicker, but at the very least, I'd love to see kickoffs go out of the endzone for a touchback if you hit it at full power.

2. Field Goals using power bar. In the original Tecmo Bowl Field Goals used the power bar. I liked this much better. The longer the field goal the easier it was to block. AKB could be used for accuracy where a certain percentage of kicks based on AKB would go wide.

I had a similar idea, but opposite. The arrow would still be used for FGs. Kick Ability would be accuracy and Avoid Block would be length. Your idea is pretty sweet, too. The response I got a few years ago was that nobody really gave two sh ts about the kicking game to look into it.

3. Punts use moving arrow thingy. Use the moving arrow on punts instead of field goals. This would allow the punts to be angled, maybe AKB could be to allow for a random distance range based on rating.

3a. Allow punts to be angled out of bounds.

3b. Use one of the A B buttons to be able to call a fair catch on a punt.

I like the power meter on punts, but being able to angle them would be sick. Again, do enough ppl care about punts to look into it?

4. Make onside kick recovery based on the actual nfl recovery rate of @ 15%. When kicked a random number of some sort wouild be generated with 15% of results making it so that the first kicking team player to touch the ball would recover, while 85% of the results would make it so that the 1st receiving team player to touch the ball would recover.

No add'l thoughts here. I think it's good right about where it is. I don't know what the current "Tecmo" rate is. Do you want more or less recoveries? It can be accomplished by slightly increasing or decreasing the speed of the defenders.

[buck]

decent ideas, but probably special teams doesn't mean very much with an "original style" tsb - only a hacked version which makes special teams more important.

I have never seen MAN controlled player 2 get an onsides kick recovery (using original style ratings and speed), so I like the idea of altering onsides kicks. I would also like to see kickoffs go out of the back of the endzone with full power.

a quick note on "touchback hack", have you noticed that when you run out of the endzone, if you run back into the endzone you will still get the touchback?

Edited September 11, 2012 by buck

[TecmoTurd]

THese ideas are really great...more simple alterations to make the game that much better...

[Carther]

a quick note on "touchback hack", have you noticed that when you run out of the endzone, if you run back into the endzone you will still get the touchback?

Yeah, but I think it is worth it to have the touchback, but if a Man opponent did that it would be really lame of them.

I would also like to see kickoffs go out of the back of the endzone with full power.

This is possible now if you just bump up the max kick distance. It is one of the problems I was originally having with my 1960's roms. I moved the kickoff to the 40 and max kickoffs were going out of the endzone and triggering a safety.

I have thought about putting this hack into my roms, but had 1 reason not to. If you scored at the end of the game with just a few seconds left and then kicked a kickoff out of the endzone all of the time would run off of the clock because the clock starts when the ball is kicked. If the clock could be changed to start when the kick was recieved I would put this hack into all of my games.

Edited September 11, 2012 by Carther

[bruddog]

1. That would be nice. I've thought about that one. Kickoff distance matters even in non-hacked tecmo.

2. Not sure this is a great improvement. It's pretty easy to get pretty much max power all the time. Unless you made it so that

it was extra sensitive at the end of the bar. Sort of a power or exponential weighting.

3. The punt return game needs MUCH more work than the punting aspect. Much like interception returns its almost impossible to return a punt for a TD vs an army of 69rp defenders. Not sure if I've ever returned one in an original rom game unless it was botched. Maybe once with Cincy and their 69ms punt return game. But punting is pretty rare given the limited number of possessions and average gain per play so it doesnt really matter that much.

4. That would be nice.

One thing I cant stand is how much of the game clock a kick return or punt return takes up. Literally it takes up almost 20% of a quarter to return a kick for a TD. I've toyed with the idea of further boosting of all the speeds but it would require a lot of testing. The Tecmo Street level of speed is about what I'm thinking for Kick and punt returns.

so that returns are over quick.

[Carther]

2. Not sure this is a great improvement. It's pretty easy to get pretty much max power all the time. Unless you made it so that

it was extra sensitive at the end of the bar. Sort of a power or exponential weighting.

You could make it so that the more power you used the less accurate the kick was.

One thing I cant stand is how much of the game clock a kick return or punt return takes up. Literally it takes up almost 20% of a quarter to return a kick for a TD. I've toyed with the idea of further boosting of all the speeds but it would require a lot of testing. The Tecmo Street level of speed is about what I'm thinking for Kick and punt returns.

so that returns are over quick.

I would think the way to go with the kickoff return would be to have the clock slow down instead of having the players speed up.

3. The punt return game needs MUCH more work than the punting aspect. Much like interception returns its almost impossible to return a punt for a TD vs an army of 69rp defenders. Not sure if I've ever returned one in an original rom game unless it was botched. Maybe once with Cincy and their 69ms punt return game. But punting is pretty rare given the limited number of possessions and average gain per play so it doesnt really matter that much.

On an actual punt return if you make it past the first 2 or 3 cover guys you go pretty far. Is there anyway to have the 69ms boost last for only a limited time, for example the coverage team has a speed of 69ms for 5 seconds and then reverts back to their normal ms?

Edited September 11, 2012 by Carther

[buck]

One thing I cant stand is how much of the game clock a kick return or punt return takes up. Literally it takes up almost 20% of a quarter to return a kick for a TD. I've toyed with the idea of further boosting of all the speeds but it would require a lot of testing. The Tecmo Street level of speed is about what I'm thinking for Kick and punt returns.

so that returns are over quick.

that is the solution I think of - to just bump the speed of the whole return team to matchup with the kicking team. it would have the added benefit of making returns "exciting" and like you said, take up less game time.

2. Not sure this is a great improvement. It's pretty easy to get pretty much max power all the time. Unless you made it so that

it was extra sensitive at the end of the bar. Sort of a power or exponential weighting.

You could make it so that the more power you used the less accurate the kick was.

those are very good ideas, too.

[Bodom]

On an actual punt return if you make it past the first 2 or 3 cover guys you go pretty far. Is there anyway to have the 69ms boost last for only a limited time, for example the coverage team has a speed of 69ms for 5 seconds and then reverts back to their normal ms?

If I'm not mistaken, you can remove the boost altogether - not just on special teams, but on defense as well on picked plays....and the QB boost when he decides to run on a pass play.

[Bodom]

I also wonder if there's a way to eliminate clock movement on kickoffs? When an XP is kicked, no time runs off the clock. It's either really simple to do this for kickoffs...or impossible.

[buck]

If I'm not mistaken, you can remove the boost altogether - not just on special teams, but on defense as well on picked plays....and the QB boost when he decides to run on a pass play.

yeah, you can remove boosts. but that doesn't change the fact that all the offense players have 69 RP (using original style ratings), and the return team doesn't.

[Bodom]

yeah, you can remove boosts. but that doesn't change the fact that all the offense players have 69 RP (using original style ratings), and the return team doesn't.

True. But that can also easily be changed. Personally, I hate the OG ratings. So much more can be accomplished by reducing RP and making RS matter.

[buck]

True. But that can also easily be changed. Personally, I hate the OG ratings. So much more can be accomplished by reducing RP and making RS matter.

you're preaching to the highspeed choir?

[Bodom]

you're preaching to the highspeed choir?

I know.

I always talk about hacks/edits under the assumption that other hacks/edits will need to be made to make it work.

But anyways, I'll stop hijacking Carther's Spec. Teams thread. I'm going to start a separate thread about "Offensive RS, RP, MS" to get some ideas going.

[Carther]

So the offensive team does punt coverage. Is there any way to make it so that the defensive team will cover punts instead? Who covers kickoffs offense or defense?

Edited September 12, 2012 by Carther

[Bodom]

Offense is on the field when you punt. Doubt it can be changed to D.

Kickoffs are covered by the Defense. The specific formation (what positions line up where) are listed somewhere.

This thread talks about Punt Coverage Boosts (towards the bottom)

http://tecmobowl.org/forum/topic/4162-shorter-punts-rom-hack/

In fact, this thread has links to various threads about the special teams stuff you're talking about.

http://tecmobowl.org/forum/topic/9725-directory-of-hacking-docs-updated-05162010-knobbe/

[Bodom]

Here's the Kickoff Formations

Edited September 12, 2012 by Bodom

[Carther]

Offense is on the field when you punt. Doubt it can be changed to D.

I am pretty sure it can be changed to Defense, the question is can anyone here do it. I believe it would not be too hard. When you call a punt the punter is inserted for the quarterback I believe. You would need to instert defensive players for the rest of the skill players. When the possession officially changes the defense is inserted.

There are two questions:

1. Is it too hard to do.

2. Would inserting the defensive secondary and a linebacker or two, help fix punt returns.

I am sure, buck, brudog, jstout or cxrom would know about the feasability.

Edited September 12, 2012 by Carther

[hurricane55]

W e have looked on TSB 3, and found nothing. It i s on the to do list. My guess is it loads the offense/defense and then masks only the returner or kicker over the spot. If found, would need to mask all positoons. We want to use more backups to allow for the whole team aspect. Backups are rarely used except for injuries.