New Base NES ROM (32-Team Original TSB Gameplay)

[GameplayLoop]

TecmoBowl.org Base ROM (32-Team Original TSB Gameplay)

View File

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"TecmoBowl.org Base ROM" This is cx_rom's 32-team v1.05 with only the following changes:

 

1. NFC West "Offense Preference" Bug

(when playing live, heavy pass does heavy rush)
x273B4 change to x20 xB6 x9F

SET(0x273b4, 0x20b69f)

 

2. NFC West "SIM" Bugs

x27479 to x2747B should be x20 xB6 x9F (this goes to cx_rom's written code for Team 1)

x27481 to x27483 should be x20 xB6 x9F (this goes to cx_rom's written code for Team 2)

SET(0x27479, 0x20b69f)

 

SET(0x27481, 0x20b69f)

x27FCE should be xE0 (this makes it compare team value correctly)

 

SET(0x27fce, 0xe0)

 

3. Player-2 Condition Fix

SET(0x30e55, 0x20809f)

SET(0x31f90, 0xa66ee46df00218603860)

 

*regarding offense SIM and SIM calculations, for the TE to be calculated properly with SIM values

(changed the byte at x175CB from 04 to 05, see http://tecmobowl.org...ata/#entry90243)

 

4. Large Helmet Graphics

 

Keithisgood's graphics updates found here: http://tecmobowl.org/topic/53374-new-helmet-logos/

 

5. Mini Helmet Graphics

 

Keithisgood's graphics updates found here: http://tecmobowl.org/topic/53631-new-mini-helmets-logos/ (special thanks to Adam5000, & Jstout)

 

6. NFL Player Association Graphic

 

Keithisgood's graphic updates found in the above link.

 

7. AFC / NFC Pro Bowl Logo Graphics

 

Keithisgood ditto above.

 

8. Intro Scrolling Text "NFL Super Pro Football" = "NFL Tecmo Super Bowl"

 

Buck did this.

 

9. "1991 Roster" = "Team Roster" Text

 

Buck did this.

 

10. Large Helmet Graphics

 

Keith did this.

 

11. 3 NFL Logos

 

Keith did this.

 

12. Options Screen Fix

 

Keith did this.

 

• Category
  Tecmo Super Bowl - NES

 

UPDATES                                                             

 

"TecmoBowl.org x1" This is cx_rom's 32-team v1.05 with only the following changes:

 

1. NFC West "Offense Preference" Bug

(when playing live, heavy pass does heavy rush)
x273B4 change to x20 xB6 x9F

SET(0x273b4, 0x20b69f)

 

2. NFC West "SIM" Bugs

x27479 to x2747B should be x20 xB6 x9F (this goes to cx_rom's written code for Team 1)

x27481 to x27483 should be x20 xB6 x9F (this goes to cx_rom's written code for Team 2)

SET(0x27479, 0x20b69f)

 

SET(0x27481, 0x20b69f)

 

x27FCE should be xE0 (this makes it compare team value correctly)

 

SET(0x27fce, 0xe0)

 

3. Player-2 Condition Fix

SET(0x30e55, 0x20809f)

SET(0x31f90, 0xa66ee46df00218603860)

 

*regarding offense SIM and SIM calculations, for the TE to be calculated properly with SIM values

(changed the byte at x175CB from 04 to 05, see http://tecmobowl.org...ata/#entry90243)

 

4. Large Helmet Graphics

 

Keithisgood's graphics updates found here: http://tecmobowl.org/topic/53374-new-helmet-logos/

 

5. Mini Helmet Graphics

 

Keithisgood's graphics updates found here: http://tecmobowl.org/topic/53631-new-mini-helmets-logos/ (special thanks to Adam5000, & Jstout)

 

6. NFL Player Association Graphic

 

Keithisgood's graphic updates found in the above link.

 

7. AFC / NFC Pro Bowl Logo Graphics

 

Keithisgood ditto above.

 

8. Intro Scrolling Text "NFL Super Pro Football" = "NFL Tecmo Super Bowl"

 

Buck did this.

 

9. "1991 Roster" = "Team Roster" Text

 

Buck did this.

 

10. Large Helmet Graphics

 

Keith did this.

 

11. 3 NFL Logos

 

Keith did this.

 

12. Options Screen Fix

 

Keith did this.

 

 

 

QUESTIONS                                                        

 

NOTES                                                                 

 

DOWNLOAD                                                               

 

[bruddog]

Honestly I feel most of the people making roms here would just end up changing the "base rom" to include hacks they deem essential. The ones that would just use the base rom and do nothing else probably won't even care what the base rom is. 

If I ever got around to it I'd write a tool that could apply some of the more simple hacks with a menu click. But don't hold your breath waiting for it because its so far down the pipeline. 

To me every hack I apply drives a rom to be more representive of current  NFL play.This isn't what you are looking for but I don't really know how to answer your question the way you are asking it so I'll just list some of the hacks I've spoken about many times before

 

GRAPHICS

Other than the correct helmet designs,midfield logo, and maybe updated player faces most of the graphics stuff wears off quickly.

 

 

I'll try and break my  hacks down into groups from most important to least

 

 

weighted grapple hack -  essential because defensive players on average make tackles in the NFL. I won't bust out all the numbers but in the nfl on average the defensive player is making the tackle 80-90% of the time. Its not representing current nfl play if you can't ever tackle another player one on one. Broken tackles are the exception not the norm. 

 

 in-game playbook hack  - tecmo's useable plays are so small as it is its nice to be able to change things around

 

Player 2 conditions fix - simply fixing something that is broken

 

 better interception returns- one of the more exciting parts of the nfl totally whiffed on by normal tecmo

 

My Hack that allows QBs to have completion rating/interception rating, defenders to have stop completion/ incterception rating.

 

QB fumble rate increased- tecmo doesnt even come close to representing the rate QB fumble on sacks in the nfl.

 

Adjusted pass arc- this makes it so guys with high passing speed don't suck at deep passes. and guys with lowish PS aren't great

at it

 

 

Harder to gain good positive yardage running consistently. The median run in the nfl is like 2 yards and 

20% of runs go for 0 or negative yardage. 

 

***********************************************************************************************************************************

 

 OL/DL hack

 

 Shorter max FG distance

 

Injuries on in preseason

 

 adjusted probabilities for fumbling, passing, pass block, field goal block

 

************************************************************************************************************************************

no one would agree on what these would be for a base rom and most think this maddenizes tecmo to much but

I'll put them here anyways

 

new plays

 

selectable defenses 

[GameplayLoop]

You're entirely correct about my misuse of language in noting the purpose of this thread, Bruddog. My total bad.

I shouldn't have said "represent current NFL play" in my suggestion of listing hacks, because that's not entirely what I meant. I more or less meant additions (visually-related or game options) that were made to enhance the original TSB shell (ability to change the in-game playbook of the 32-team ROM, as an example), but change as little as possible what are the TSB gameplay mechanics.

But, nevertheless, your list of hacks is a great science-dropping for what would be a potential 'authentic NFL base ROM' (gameplay hack-centric), which I think I might split off into a separate thread, because I earnestly believe we should have two bases...

1. Tecmo Super Bowl ORIGINAL-style base ROM, which would be as close to the original, but updated as much as can be without changing vast elements of the on-field gameplay (my original intention with this thread).

2. Tecmo Super Bowl 'authentic NFL experience hacks' base ROM. Your list of hacks got my saliva glands flowing, and have refreshed my interest to find out if it's possible to agree on hacks that make TSB more authentic to the NFL experience. I know you've spent a ton of time considering this, as is evident in your work.

I'm gonna respond to your suggestions soon, but I'm also goin to start a new thread similar to this one, where I also copy your above suggestions to use as conversation material for the 'authentic NFL experience hacks' thread. Ideally, I would hope that whatever the updated ORIGINAL TSB base ROM turns out to be, that ROM could be used as the foundation for the 'authentic experience hacks' ROM.

[Disclaimer: The above delineation of names I'm using are just for lack of better / official monikers presently.]

[GameplayLoop]

GRAPHICS

Other than the correct helmet designs, midfield logo, and maybe updated player faces most of the graphics stuff wears off quickly.

Accurate helmet designs, accurate on-field jersey colors, accurate NFL logo screens, updated mid-field logo, updated player faces. I agree with all of this. Player faces are, clearly, the most difficult aspect of this list. Most of us, to my knowledge, don't even know how to properly edit the faces in the puzzle that is the HEX code where they're stored in TSB. Each tile is used multiple times, in various player portraits. A program that edits faces would be amazing, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it. I'd say all of this was more easily possible than not, save for the faces. Maybe we could update a few faces to reflect more traditionally modern changes in facial hair, longer hair for different ethnicities and etc.., simply to provide for more wiggle room in assigning new player portraits to contemporary players? Also, I get that graphics are a very surface change, but let's not throw the baby out with the bath water just because peoples priorities are different in what they find appealing about an updated ROM.

 

GAMEPLAY

In-game Playbook Hack  - tecmo's useable plays are so small as it is its nice to be able to change things around

Definitely. Already available in CX_ROM's hack. What I wish is that there was a way to fix the 'back out of the menu' frozen menu overlay bug that plagues the 32-team ROM.

 

Player 2 conditions fix - simply fixing something that is broken

 

Definitely.

 

 Better interception returns - one of the more exciting parts of the nfl totally whiffed on by normal tecmo

 

This might be a little too radical for an original-style ROM.

 

My Hack that allows QBs to have completion rating / interception rating, defenders to have stop completion / incterception rating.

 

Ditto this, as much as I love the idea of creating deeper meaning to QB stats, and utilizing their various attributes for something more beneficial to gameplay than what original TSB does. *See the other hacks-based thread for more on this.

 

QB fumble rate increased - tecmo doesnt even come close to representing the rate QB fumble on sacks in the nfl.

 

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM.

 

Adjusted pass arc - this makes it so guys with high passing speed don't suck at deep passes. and guys with lowish PS aren't great

at it

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM.

 

Harder to gain good positive yardage running consistently. The median run in the nfl is like 2 yards and 

20% of runs go for 0 or negative yardage. 

 

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM. I'd be interested to see this. I'm not opposed to turning down the volume on Tecmo Super Bowl's consistent 200+ yard running games.

 

***********************************************************************************************************************************

 

 OL/DL hack

 

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM.

 

 Shorter max FG distance

 

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM.

 

Injuries on in preseason

 

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM.

 

 adjusted probabilities for fumbling, passing, pass block, field goal block

 

I think this makes a ton of sense for the 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM.

 

************************************************************************************************************************************

no one would agree on what these would be for a base rom and most think this maddenizes tecmo to much but

I'll put them here anyways

 

new plays

 

selectable defenses 

 

I agree with you completely that the above two suggestions are too customizable to find some sort of consensus, even in an 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM. I also think that changing the gameplay of TSB to take out the play-selecting Blitz option is changing TSB a little too much for a base ROM concept.

Only because Bruddog originally posted his thoughts about specific hacks did I respond briefly to them in this thread. I have copied his suggestions to the other 'Authentic NFL Experience Hacks' ROM thread for a more detailed response / discussion.

[GameplayLoop]

ORIGINAL STYLE SUGGESTION:

Kickoff positioning.

[DFM]

I don't think any of this falls under original gameplay. >> Authentic NFL Experience ROM http://tecmobowl.org/topic/52872-new-base-nes-rom-w-authentic-nfl-experience-hacks/

[GameplayLoop]

I couldn't agree more about the need for a new playbook.  In my opinion, that was the original Tecmo's greatest weakness.  When my group played in the 90's, we were basically all forced to use the run-n-shoot playbook exclusively because that was the only one that had proper left/right balance and enough plays so that you weren't tipping your hand pre-snap.

 

I would love to introduce perfect balance to all the major offensive sets, and also bring in four solid shotgun runs and a new "spread option" set (4 runs, 4 passes using a pistol QB and a RB on each side).  Both the shotgun and spread option would involve some zone read plays.  Here's my idea, attached in pdf.

I'm of the opinion that all playbook changes should be kept for the hack-centric 'Authentic NFL Experience' ROM. Again, we're talking about a base TSB ROM in this thread. Little frills--just the necessary updates to bring it up to speed with the contemporary visual elements of the NFL, or non-intrusive game option edits. It should still be TSB gameplay at its core. The goal is to have an updated place to start from CX_ROMs 2007-built TSB 32-team ROM.

As such, I'm going to move your thoughts over to the other thread! I like the ideas here, though.

[Bodom]

I don't think any of this falls under original gameplay. >> Authentic NFL Experience ROM http://tecmobowl.org/topic/52872-new-base-nes-rom-w-authentic-nfl-experience-hacks/

As Mr. Chow says in the Hangover...."not my probrem".

Actually, you're right.  I copied it over to the other thread.  Thanks for the heads-up.

[bruddog]

Who is the target audience for this original style Base ROM? The facebook page crowd? The random new person on the board? the average tecmoer?

 

Most of the hard core rom creators here and the people likely to respond to this thread are going to apply whatever hacks they see fit. Just my 2 cents.

 

But as an original style base rom I'd want as few hacks as possible. 

 

 

YES:

-graphics tweaks,  

-player 2 conditions display fix ,

-no fumbling in the endzone after TD fix

 

 

NO: 

- pass control/ pass accuracy fix 

- in game playbook change hack.

 

- i just think if you start adding any things that could go in the NO column this you might as well just continue down the slope to the bottom or at least very close to the bottom. 

[GameplayLoop]

Who is the target audience for this original style Base ROM? The facebook page crowd? The random new person on the board? the average tecmoer?

 

Most of the hard core rom creators here and the people likely to respond to this thread are going to apply whatever hacks they see fit. Just my 2 cents.

 

But as an original style base rom I'd want as few hacks as possible. 

 

I would say the Facebook crowd / random new person on the forum is exactly correct. The hardcore ROM creators don't need out help--totally agreed. And you're definitely right, as few hacks as possible is the way to go in my book, as well.

 

YES:

-graphics tweaks,  

-player 2 conditions display fix ,

-no fumbling in the endzone after TD fix

 

Yes.

 

NO: 

- pass control/ pass accuracy fix 

- in game playbook change hack.

 

You think we should take out the in-game playbook hack from the 32-team ROM? Interesting. Can you elaborate on your stance on this? I ask, only because it seems like a universally appreciated piece of evolution into the series.

 

- i just think if you start adding any things that could go in the NO column this you might as well just continue down the slope to the bottom or at least very close to the bottom. 

I do agree with you that most proposed changes are going to fit into the 'no' column of an original style base ROM.

[bruddog]

Honestly I'm probably just the wrong person to be answering in this thread. 

[GameplayLoop]

Honestly I'm probably just the wrong person to be answering in this thread. 

Not at all, dude. You're right on point. And I see where you're coming from about not changing anything from the actual original TSB ROM, except for what will bring it to a strictly surface level 2012 iteration. As in, a game that even the die-hard tournament players could play and feel comfortable about things not being different. Part of this discussion is, clearly, about the philosophy of these changes for a new base ROM for prospective new forum members getting into hacking.

I just think that any hacks that are going to be made from now until the end of eternity, even if they're the most basic, are going to want to include the in-game playbook editor and the available time-changing options. The tournament players are only ever going to play the original TSB. So, with that in mind, creating a base that is fundamentally the same game experience as TSB, but slightly tweaked to include the new available options (CX_ROM's 32-team add-ons), will cover the most bases.

Dude, your input is essential. Now if we could get the other big shot TSB gurus in here (I'm not labeling myself as that) to voice their opinion, I think we'd see the end-game more clearly.

[DFM]

Honestly I'm probably just the wrong person to be answering in this thread. 

Haha!

 

I think the people that want this type of ROM are obvious. This year's vanilla release had 35k downloads. THIRTY FIVE THOUSAND

 

Creating a better base for future releases is a great idea.

[bruddog]

Dave- It was sort of a rhetorical question. I pretty much knew the answer. Honestly the facebook/social media masses should be polled.  I'd just start running polls on different hacks/ideas  and include any that go over threshold%. Tell them they can win a free cart/t-shirt and you'll probably get 100's of responses per question. 

 

That's really who this idea is targeting. The majority just care seeing the updated rosters so they can beat the computer to a bloody pulp with a juiced RG3 and run around drones in circles. Little probability subtleties,  game nuances are lost on 90% of those kind of people. 

 

I honestly don't think the fact that it was a vanilla release had much effect on the 35k downloads. It was more the great marketing and promotion of a current year rom. 

 

I could include most but not all of my hacks and just not tell anyone and I bet 90% of the people that downloaded "vanilla rom"  wouldn't even realize they were playing a rom with gameplay hacks. 

[bruddog]

A better base vanilla rom with all the obvious fixes included is a good idea. 

 

 

mgk-  I guess the playbook and time hack is OK because you don't have to use it in the game if you don't want to. Though I think actually using it is a fairly large departure from the original gameplay. 

[DFM]

Dave- It was sort of a rhetorical question. I pretty much knew the answer. Honestly the facebook/social media masses should be polled.  I'd just start running polls on different hacks/ideas  and include any that go over threshold%. Tell them they can win a free cart/t-shirt and you'll probably get 100's of responses per question. 

 

That's really who this idea is targeting. The majority just care seeing the updated rosters so they can beat the computer to a bloody pulp with a juiced RG3 and run around drones in circles. Little probability subtleties,  game nuances are lost on 90% of those kind of people. 

 

I honestly don't think the fact that it was a vanilla release had much effect on the 35k downloads. It was more the great marketing and promotion of a current year rom. 

 

I could include most but not all of my hacks and just not tell anyone and I bet 90% of the people that downloaded "vanilla rom"  wouldn't even realize they were playing a rom with gameplay hacks. 

 

A lot of this is based on assumptions and it's factually wrong. Of course this idea is targeting those who don't want hacks in their ROMs. That is what this thread is about.  

 

If you have been taking notice the users, Facebook in particular, were continuously polled for last year's ROM.  You are probably right that they couldn't identify what the hacks are precisely, but they'll be noticed. The biggest complaints that were given about 2012 had to do with the grapple hack and the FG distance. 2012 also had a ROM pack which included all of the current and popular hacks by other users. They were barely touched (this was polled too.) As much as we consider this site the holy grail of TSB fanboyism, the reality is that there are people just as obsessed, if not more so, out there. Right or wrong, they exist. 

 

Vanilla has almost all to do with 35k downloads. It wasn't a good marketing plan by accident. It's marketable because it is the same. That's the point. I was able to leverage that with complete success.

[bruddog]

As i said then im the wrong person for this thread.

[bruddog]

Or just poll those same people again

[buck]

RE: original gameplay

 

this is getting too complicated.

 

0. 32 team, god yes.  but there are some fixes needed

there is a SIM/SKP bug for the NFC West

the "menu" where you can change the quarter length (and nothing else) - rename this to "clock" or something like that and "blank out" all of the other unnecessary text on that screen ("weather" = remove) so as to not confuse

in-game playbook adjust

 

1. graphics 

yes, the best and most recent helmets and colors .  

NO to any other major graphical changes, other than year numbers and perhaps the opening screen animations

yes, modern "proads" NFL Logo, (including AFC/NFC logos)

 

2. "updates" or "fixes" that, in my opinion, can not effect the original feel

 

PA hack - PC does control, PA is interception variable.  If people want it the "old way", then just use the same rating for PC and PA.

Player 2 Condition Fix - self e explanatory

(see that "quickness" is still unused...I cannot think of an application that does not significantly change the rating system or the "original" style)

 

So, see, this is very simple.  And I think that you will win many souls with this formula - more importantly, not lose any.

 

PS - I can help get this ROM going.  At least with the changes I mentioned above.

Edited January 24, 2013 by buck

[bruddog]

I dont see how making passing ability do something isnt the same in terms of how the game plays as making quickness determine how often a db breaks up a pass.

[DFM]

I say we use Buck's purist ROM. I forgot it existed.

 

FIXED!

 

/thread

[buck]

the difference is that everybody knows how to rate PA and PC and what it does; whereas a "quickness" or your hack is too complicated and a totally unknown system (there is no standard to compare to - whereas with PA/PC, there is a standard to relate to).

 

let me throw something out here in a little bit.

 

I dont see how making passing ability do something isnt the same in terms of how the game plays as making quickness determine how often a db breaks up a pass.

Edited January 24, 2013 by buck

[Bodom]

You could probably hack the shit out of a ROM and release it as an official ROM. I bet all of those 35K ppl that downloaded it 1) wont notice and 2) wont care. The casual Tecmo player is looking for a roster update. Most people probably dont even realize what each attribute does.

[buck]

but the thing is to make an "honest" vanilla rom.  I think more people care about it being minimally hacked than you think.  remember fatcheerleader? he and his whole crew only used the "purist" type modern roms.

 

If bruddog disagrees with the PA hack, I can understand leaving it out - but I do think that it's reasonable to use it.

 

You could probably hack the shit out of a ROM and release it as an official ROM. I bet all of those 35K ppl that downloaded it 1) wont notice and 2) wont care. The casual Tecmo player is looking for a roster update. Most people probably dont even realize what each attribute does.

[bruddog]

SIMPLE RESPONSE: I would vote for just leaving the PA hack out. 

 

******************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************

Using quickness to mean something is very nearly the same same thing.  As it stands the interception rating on defense both determines if a ball is completed/intercepted/batted away 

 

You "know" that a 75int guy is good at stopping passes as well as intercepting them.

 

Under my system a 75int guy is still as good at intercepting passes as he was before.

 

But if he has 38 quickness or "coverage" as I would rename it, well he will allow completions and deflect passes like a 38 int defender would.

 

How is that complicated or totally unknown?

 

 Its splitting the singular INT rating apart in the apart like the pass control/ pass ability does

 

 

 

******************************************************************************************************

On a side note  the original version of the PA/PC hack makes it so a LOW ish PC high PA QB is better than a high PC high PA qb because he will be better at throwing deep bombs. That doesn't make much intuitive sense to the average person.  

 

Current PC/PA hack

 

PC= is ball on target/overthrown/jj intercepted

 

PA= is ball completed/deflected/intercepted on non-dive or jump attempt with defender in coverage

 

My PC/PA hack

 

PC= is ball on target/overthrown/jj intecepted/intercepted on non-dive or jump attempt with defender in coverage

 

PA= is ball completed/deflected

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