jstout Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Here is how to use the Pass Control and Pass Accuracy as used in the TSB III (SNES).The NES reads the PC when the ball is to be thrown (how accurate the ball is thrown) and then again elsewhere when the ball reaches a player (for a miss, drop, catch, deflection, or interception).Pass Control = Ability to throw on targetPass Accuracy = Ability to complete a passAt x29E54:20 F7 9F JSR $9FF7 ; Go to new PA readAt x2A007:A0 88 LDY #$88 ; Read PA4C DD 9F JMP $9FDD ; Go to Normal CodeNow PA will actually mean something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 wow... how will this change CCs and JJs? does PA effect INTs at all? now it's time to do some serious ratings testing...any recommended settings/combinations? crazy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstout Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share Posted February 22, 2008 how will this change CCs and JJs?does PA effect INTs at all?now it's time to do some serious ratings testing...any recommended settings/combinations?After my changes PA will be the only number used to check for QB ability to complete a pass. So Interceptions/CCs will be based upon the QB's PA, Receivers' REC, and Defenders' INT.The PC will be the number used for how accurate the throws are. So JJs will be determined mostly by timing and this number (as in overthrows).To check combos I suppose you could use TSB 3 as a reference or just play around a while. The easiest changes to view would be someone like John Elway. His PC is 31 and PA 69 and originally had a hard time completing passes and was inaccurate (obviously accuracy of the pass is very subtle as even Grogan doesn't spray everything). Now he should have the same inaccuracy but complete a lot more covered passes.Some additional info if anyone wants to goof around with values. Each Accuracy is 4 hex numbers each is pulled and compared to a different random number depending on the situation.# Pass Control Skills (6 is the top and 100 is the bottom)SET(0x2be14,0xf7348080)SET(0x2be18,0xee328080)SET(0x2be1c,0xe5308078)SET(0x2be20,0xdc2e8078)SET(0x2be24,0xd32c7870)SET(0x2be28,0xca2a7870)SET(0x2be2c,0xc1287868)SET(0x2be30,0xb8267868)SET(0x2be34,0xaf247060)SET(0x2be38,0xa6227060)SET(0x2be3c,0x9d207058)SET(0x2be40,0x941e7058)SET(0x2be44,0x8b1c7050)SET(0x2be48,0x821a7050)SET(0x2be4c,0x79187048)SET(0x2be50,0x70166848) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 So, using your new PA code, how would the ratings PC/PA need to be set up in order to make the QB throw exactly as he did before (only using PC - ie stock TSB)?PA = PC?I'm asking because I want to start with some setups (PS/PC) I'm used to - then tweak PA and see how things change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstout Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share Posted February 22, 2008 So, using your new PA code, how would the ratings PC/PA need to be set up in order to make the QB throw exactly as he did before (only using PC - ie stock TSB)?PA = PC?Yes, New_PA = Old_PC would be exactly like the original. So PC and PA would be the same skill.I and others would probably like to hear the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNFL Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 One of my biggest gripes of the NES game was this issue. I'd love to see it correct. Good work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Moon Rison Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Wow, this is fantastic news. I am sure that high PA players will now be viewed with more value once you have finished. Some online current roster leagues might now factor this into how they create players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 here are the 'SET' commands to implement this using TSBTool:SET( 0x29e54, 0x20f79f )SET( 0x2a007, 0xa0884cdd9f ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruddog Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 It's really a subtle difference as far as how many overthrows you see. I wouldn't even know quite how to value it. It would be a rating more valueable than avoid pass block but less valuable then the current PC, PS and QB MSWow, this is fantastic news. I am sure that high PA players will now be viewed with more value once you have finished. Some online current roster leagues might now factor this into how they create players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 It's really a subtle difference as far as how many overthrows you see. I wouldn't even know quite how to value it. It would be a rating more valueable than avoid pass block but less valuable then the current PC, PS and QB MSWow, this is fantastic news. I am sure that high PA players will now be viewed with more value once you have finished. Some online current roster leagues might now factor this into how they create players.Well, now that PA dictates "Covered Catches" , how would it not be important?I'm going to experiment to make a good JJ & good CC QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTupa Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Watch out for the Bears and Broncos now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruddog Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Ya but PA is now just what PC was before more or less! The fact that PC now controls overthrow percentage The way to make a good JJ and CC QB is the same as before. Under the original schemeHonestly the best JJ qb has low-medium PS with high PCThe best CC qb has high PS and high PC. (Increasing PS across the board is one way to cut down on jjs)Under the new schemea low-medium PS with high PA is the best JJ QBa high PS with high PA will be the best CC QbThe PC will now just control how often the throw is errant...... as in catachable by no one. It's hard to notice much difference unless you are playing with the extreme ends of the spectrum of thsi rating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruddog Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 PA just replaces PC in value. PC becomes slighty more valuable than APB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBlueman Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 how will this change CCs and JJs? What are CCs and JJs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTupa Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 how will this change CCs and JJs? What are CCs and JJs? coverage catches and timed/lucky jumping catches Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted July 12, 2008 Share Posted July 12, 2008 How does this (PA as INT&Completion control) change with season 'juice' values - With this code, Does the 'PC juice value' now boost the 'PA value' (instead of PC) when playing the CPU in later weeks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knobbe Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 PC=100=no JJ?It really makes you wonder if they simply forgot to implement this feature.Good find! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruddog Posted October 3, 2009 Share Posted October 3, 2009 So I finally mostly figured out how the number work. Refer yourself to the byte strings listed below by jstout.ex 06 pc @2be14 f7 34 80 80The first byte is the chance the pass is on target. It gets compared to a random byte from 00-FF. If its less than the random byte its on target otherwise there is a chance for an underthrow/overthrowThis means 06PC= 4% chance of no underthrow/overthrow100PC= 56% chance of being no underthrow/overthrowUnderthrow= ball goes out of bounds, stopped wr has to move to get the ball, Wr stops mid route.Overthrow= ball potentially sails way over WR head, just enough that he can jump an catch it or dive and catch itThe second byte determines if the pass will be an underthrow or overthrow if its not ON target. If the byte is greater than the random number it will be under thrownA 06PC will have a 20% chance of underthrowing it if the ball is off target...or a total chance of 19.6% of throwing an underthrow on any passA 100PC qb will have a 9% chance of underthrowing it if the ball is off target...or a total chance of 4% of throwing an underthrow on any pass.A 06PC will have a 76.9% chance of throwing an overthrow on any passA 100PC qb will have a 40% chance of throwing an overthrow on any pass.The 3rd byte has something to do with the underthrows. I'm not quite sure what it does. Perhaps the smaller the number the more catchable the underthrows tend to be.There was too much code to sort through for me to try and figure it out. The 4th byte has to do with overthrows. And this is kind of interesting. The bytes only range from 68-80. However if you set this byte to 0. The overthrows are never overthrows. They act like normal on target passes. So by lowering this byte you could drastically reduce the number of long jj bombs or at least moreso for shitty qbs. Or you could increase the chance for underthrows. Timed jj's would still work as normal. It's funny because after looking at this the 50-56 pc qb is probably the best for jjs since they run little risk of getting jj inted except by carrier/haddix and they will get more lob balls than a higer pc qb. Some additional info if anyone wants to goof around with values. Each Accuracy is 4 hex numbers each is pulled and compared to a different random number depending on the situation.# Pass Control Skills (6 is the top and 100 is the bottom)SET(0x2be14,0xf7348080)SET(0x2be18,0xee328080)SET(0x2be1c,0xe5308078)SET(0x2be20,0xdc2e8078)SET(0x2be24,0xd32c7870)SET(0x2be28,0xca2a7870)SET(0x2be2c,0xc1287868)SET(0x2be30,0xb8267868)SET(0x2be34,0xaf247060)SET(0x2be38,0xa6227060)SET(0x2be3c,0x9d207058)SET(0x2be40,0x941e7058)SET(0x2be44,0x8b1c7050)SET(0x2be48,0x821a7050)SET(0x2be4c,0x79187048)SET(0x2be50,0x70166848) quince3800 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted October 3, 2009 Share Posted October 3, 2009 Agreed. 44-50 has always seemed best. re: 50 PC best for JJs - I've known this from playing the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTupa Posted October 3, 2009 Share Posted October 3, 2009 So passing speed has nothing to do with overthrows/underthrows? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 bruddog, thanks for breaking down the PC controls - that is nice. I plan on tweaking PC for shit qbs so they can't throw bomb JJs . question: can all the attributes be broken down like this? the physics of TSB can really be altered if you dig this deep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruddog Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Not really. Unless you hack the rom and make passing speed too fast. So passing speed has nothing to do with overthrows/underthrows? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTupa Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Not really. Unless you hack the rom and make passing speed too fast. So passing speed has nothing to do with overthrows/underthrows?Well, I guess Marino just had too high PC and Brister and Tolliver too low PC. Just made it seem like high PS qbs couldn't throw consistent jjs. I could swear the arc is lower and easier to block though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruddog Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Are you talking about the short 10-15 yard timed ones or the 70yd variety? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgboud2 Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Marino seems prone to throwing long on divers on ~20 yard routes on orignal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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