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Baron von Lector

Madden-Tecmo Calculator

45 posts in this topic

vlookup is easy as heck.  it's just a formula type command in excel, that you just write in a cell and it performs the function and returns the results.

 

anyways, I second the "excel" option.  

Edited by buck

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I will definitely look into this whole vlookup phenomenon.  I will still finish this calculator.  One reason I write calculators (a la my RBI Baseball and Ken Griffey calculators) are that it keeps me fresh in Visual Basic.  For the degree I'm working on, I require five semesters of programming.  It's practice, plus, I just like inputting data into calculators.

 

Speaking of inputting into a calculator, here's a test run of me putting in James Harrison's (top) and J.J. Watt's (bottom) data into the calculator:

 

Untitled.png

 

EDIT: As I'm preparing to work the DBs into the calculator, I notice that defensive players don't have the umbrella 69 rating for Rushing Power like offensive players do.  Gotta work that in.

Edited by Baron von Lector

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69 RP for defender is beyond original, right?  I mean, bob nelson had to be a mistake, I would throw that 69 RP out.  I think 56 is the normal max RP (LT, Haddix, etc).

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I did remove Bob Nelson's 69 out of the equation, because I think it was added originally because all offensive players had it, but forgot to remove it when they were tallying defensive players.  I'm using TecmoGeek.com as a guide for original Tecmo values and just noticed that defensive players don't have the umbrella 69 RP rating that RBs, WRs, and TEs do.

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5 minutes ago, Baron von Lector said:

I did remove Bob Nelson's 69 out of the equation, because I think it was added originally because all offensive players had it, but forgot to remove it when they were tallying defensive players.  I'm using TecmoGeek.com as a guide for original Tecmo values and just noticed that defensive players don't have the umbrella 69 RP rating that RBs, WRs, and TEs do.

 

yeah, take notice that usually RP is only a notch or maybe two (for better players) higher than the DEFENDERS RS.  there might be just a few 31/44 defenders, or some 31/31, though.  can't exactly recall.

Edited by buck

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but anyways, it would be cool if you came up with a totally new default scale, since you are trying to incorporate madden ratings.  because you will find that you're really limited when you follow TSB "patterns" for 69 offense RP and the RP notch of defenders (I think bruddog alluded to this).  

 

but always make sure you play test (v MAN and COM) your new rating defaults to make sure they play good.

 

I've been all over with those scales, inside the normal physics and outside.  It is hard to find a good balance!  they did it pretty good the first time!

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6 minutes ago, Baron von Lector said:

I'm taking the RP directly from Madden's ACC (acceleration) attribute.  The scale I'm using is (which may be adjusted later up or down):

 

Untitled.png

 

 

that seems reasonable, I think.  here is something from Bodom, after he did extensive play testing with RS/RP for Defenders.

 

 I think he is right with his conclusions, see BOLD text:.

 

 

Quote
The high RS/RP and RS/MS seemed to have the same impact while the high RP/MS guy was way behind.          
The common factor for the better rushers was RS.                     
 I'm sure for man vs. man games, using a defender with high MS would be ideal, but for computer controlled players it seems to be the least valuable of the speed attributes. 
RS-RP-MS...in that order. Until RP becomes greater than 56, then RP seemed to take over.              

 

and here's his original post (I copied it some time ago)

 

Quote

This might already be common knowledge, but figured I'd post it anyways. I did some testing last night with DL speeds. I changed all OL attributes to 6/6/6/6. 

Jacked up DL HP to 100 so they would break through every time.

First sample:

6/6/13

6/13/6

13/6/6

I found that the 13RS got to the QB first every time, then the 13RP.

Second sample:

50/44/44

44/50/44

44/44/50

Same thing here - RS, RP then MS.

Third sample:

88/81/81

81/88/81

81/81/88

This time it was different. The 88 RP was first followed by the 88 RS.

I decided to test this out further using a 3 notch difference instead of 1 (example: 25/6/6). What I noticed is that RS is the most important factor until RP gets to about 56, then RP becomes the most important factor. In no scenario did the guy with the higher MS ever get to the QB first.

One final test, I used.

50/50/13

13/50/50

50/13/50.

The high RS/RP and RS/MS seemed to have the same impact while the high RP/MS guy was way behind.

The common factor for the better rushers was RS. 

 I'm sure for man vs. man games, using a defender with high MS would be ideal, but for computer controlled players it seems to be the least valuable of the speed attributes. 

RS-RP-MS...in that order. Until RP becomes greater than 56, then RP seemed to take over.

 

Edited by buck

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As I mentioned you are going to have to make positional adjustments if you want defenders to have the same distribution as OG tecmo. Otherwise all DL will likely come out really slow using madden ratings. 

 

On one of the historical madden files i was looking at the positions had the following averages for starters

 

DT    AGIL 63 ACCEL 69 SPEED 61

DE    AGIL 73 ACCEL 78 SPEED 72

ILB  AGIL 76 ACCEL 77 SPEED 75

OLB   AGIL 79 ACCEL 81 SPEED 79

CB     AGIL 87 ACCEL 89 SPEED 89

FS    AGIL 83  ACCEL 84  SPEED 84

SS   AGIL 81 ACCEL 83  SPEED 83

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2 minutes ago, buck said:

but anyways, it would be cool if you came up with a totally new default scale, since you are trying to incorporate madden ratings.  because you will find that you're really limited when you follow TSB "patterns" for 69 offense RP and the RP notch of defenders (I think bruddog alluded to this).  

 

but always make sure you play test (v MAN and COM) your new rating defaults to make sure they play good.

 

I've been all over with those scales, inside the normal physics and outside.  It is hard to find a good balance!  they did it pretty good the first time!

 

My goal is to TRY and replicate the feel and gameplay of the original, with a similar distribution of players at each skill level.  The original's had a bell-curve type thing going where a majority (~60%) of players were in the center of the bell, and the numbers tapered off as you reached the extreme highs and lows of the bell.  To TRY and achieve this, I'm bumping the player ratings from TecmoGeek.com (who runs this site, anyways?) and EASports.com.

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if you missed that long ass post, the summary is:

 

RS-RP-MS...in that order. Until RP becomes greater than 56, then RP seemed to take over.  (regarding COM drones)

 

So, you might want to use that acceleration madden rating and apply it somewhat to RS, too?  just a thought.  I don'tknow much about madden ratings, like what is the most important for defender.  but for TSB, it looks like RS is.

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1 minute ago, buck said:

if you missed that long ass post, the summary is:

 

RS-RP-MS...in that order. Until RP becomes greater than 56, then RP seemed to take over.  (regarding COM drones)

 

So, you might want to use that acceleration madden rating and apply it somewhat to RS, too?  just a thought.  I don'tknow much about madden ratings, like what is the most important for defender.  but for TSB, it looks like RS is.

 

I definitely know I'm going to be tweaking my formulas, possibly to make them more inclusive of other ratings (versus the current 1:1).  I guess you could say I'm in the cold-run stage of things.  "Let's see how this looks."  I just worked in the ACC-to-RP formula.  Gonna post results shortly.

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Definitely gonna have to tweak the ACC-to-RP formula.  Elite LBs and DLs are scoring a little low.

 

James Harrison, J.J. Watt, and Ndonkeykong Suh.

 

Untitled.png

Edited by Baron von Lector

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1 hour ago, buck said:

if you missed that long ass post, the summary is:

 

RS-RP-MS...in that order. Until RP becomes greater than 56, then RP seemed to take over.  (regarding COM drones)

 

So, you might want to use that acceleration madden rating and apply it somewhat to RS, too?  just a thought.  I don'tknow much about madden ratings, like what is the most important for defender.  but for TSB, it looks like RS is.

 

There are a lot more ratings in madden that play a factor.  These might get too complex to add but are other things to think about or using buck's example a  4.7 Jerry Rice would be pretty bad converted to tecmo. 

as speed is nearly the only thing that matters for RB'S/WR's TE's if you use the standard tecmo rating scale and ranges. HP matters for RB's if its 94+ and matters a little bit for WR's to prevent high HP defenders(fulcher) from popcorning them. 

 

FOR ALL:

 

RAW ATHLETICISM

AGIL

ACCEL

SPEED

 

FOR ALL SKILL PLAYERS:

ROUTE RUNNING (WR/TE/ pass catching RB's) One of the things that can make slower WR's good in Madden as they run great routes that get separation due to technique. Maybe boost RS/MS/REC depending on position.

 

BALL CARRIER VISION (RB ONLY) In tecmo this would be the equivalent of passing through two collided players rather than bouncing off of them. In Madden this is basically for COM players I believe as the COM player finds the right hole sooner and is less likely to get tripped up running past DL/OL. 

 

TRUCK/BLOCK/STRENGTH- These are basically one attribute in Tecmo HP...

Strength (STR) – Provides a boost for blocking, shedding blocks, power moves, throwing and trucking.

 

 

ELUSIVENESS- "How well the runner jukes, makes spin moves, and breaks tackles"  In tecmo it could apply to any of the 4 main ratings. It would be the equivlent of havving a better chance of winning a grapple in tecmo or the defender passing through you when trying to tackle you. 

 

CATCH/CATCH IN TRAFFIC/JUMPING- Catch is the ability to catch a pass when the player is fairly open. 

 

AWARENESS- This is sort of a football intelligence rating giving players better/reactions desicions based on what they see. IE Wr option route the Wr with better awareness breaks the right way more often. 

 

FOR QBs:

Throw power

short/mid/deep accuracy

Awareness-

 

 

FOR DEFENDERS:

 

 

TECHNIQUE/SKILL

BLOCK SHED - should probably factor heavily in the HP rating for the front 5 in tecmo as that is their primary function

TACKLE - 

MAN/ZONE COVERAGE - should have some application to the int rating or as a modifier to the raw speed ratings. At least for the secondary

CATCHING/JUMPING/CATCH IN TRAFFIC- See above. 

PURSUIT - In Madden I think the players take more optimal angles the better rating they have..again boost to rs/rp

 

INTELLIGENCE

PLAY RECOGNITION -  Reacting to run or pass and defending specific routes. Also reacting properly to play action or screen plays. For tecmo this would probabliy be a modifier to the RS/RP ratings.

AWARENESS-   Reacting to the other players on the field, both teammates and opponents

 

The intelligence ratings help COM defenders play well despite maybe average athleticism. An example of this from year's past would be Eric Weddle of a few years ago. The guy isn't a super athlete by NFL standards but he was always in the right place at the right time more often than not. 

 


 

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Still playing around.  Until I incorporate other attributes, the only Madden attribute I'm using for Interception skill is MCV (Man Coverage).  Here is Richard Sherman (top), Darrelle Revis (middle), and Eric Weddle (bottom).

 

 

Untitled.png

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14 hours ago, buck said:

what is Quickness intended to do here?

 

My understanding is that it has absolutely no effect on the game, and is strictly a visual thing.  Since it's in the game, it might as well be utilized.  I tied the players' "Pursuit" attribute to this.

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I'm just hoping you use RP as a real, dynamic category for it's true function -- acceleration (towards MS).  If you just blanket all offensive players with a 69 RP, then not only do you lose one way to differentiate offensive players, but you also effectively eliminate another category (RS = starting speed) as a meaningful attribute.  The reason: 69 RP propels offensive players to their max speed almost instantaneously, so their starting speed rating becomes irrelevant.

 

I think that the general consensus is that high RS and low RP values are the trick to making all attributes matter, and to further differentiate one player from the next.

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52 minutes ago, Tecmonster said:

I'm just hoping you use RP as a real, dynamic category for it's true function -- acceleration (towards MS).  If you just blanket all offensive players with a 69 RP, then not only do you lose one way to differentiate offensive players, but you also effectively eliminate another category (RS = starting speed) as a meaningful attribute.  The reason: 69 RP propels offensive players to their max speed almost instantaneously, so their starting speed rating becomes irrelevant.

 

I think that the general consensus is that high RS and low RP values are the trick to making all attributes matter, and to further differentiate one player from the next.

 

Bad news.  I'm going with a blanket rating of RP 69 for offensive players. 

 

When I look at the ROMs I've contributed over the last few years, I've put out everything... except for an annual TSB release.  Until now, I've left it to those that do.  I know I've mentioned my site before, but on my BaronROMs.wordpress.com website, there seems to be a big gaping hole that I would like to fill with annual TSB releases.  I won't put anything on my site that didn't do, myself.  This is why I will be releasing my own version of TSB17.

 

Why do I mention this?  Because in order to remain consistent throughout the ROM, I'm developing this calculator for personal use (which I will be making available to everybody else for those who want to use it).  I want my ROM to feel as close to the original as possible, which includes the original title screen and ratings spread, including the 69 RP for offensive players.  I figure that if it worked 25 years ago for a game that is an all-time classic, it'll work now.

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