Jump to content
fatcheerleader

NHL General Discussion Mega Thread

Recommended Posts

It's quite possible that all of these things have happened in the NHL.

We might never know because people don't care enough about it!

You don't think Teemu Selanne spouts off about how stupid Swedes are?

We really do hear about it. And it really doesn't happen very often compared to the NBA, NFL, and even the major NCAA sports. Shoot, compared to even NCAA Women's basketball and the WNBA, the NHL is just plain tame. You're telling me if things happen, they don't dig it and report it in Montreal or Toronto? Those tow markets exist in an insane media bubble that even the Yankees, Patriots, or Heat can't compare to right now... shoot I can still (as a Wings fan) tell you about the Goose Loonies incident.... from way back in 1988 during a DET-EDM series. That stuff GETS OUT when it happens. Or the Mike Danton/Katie Wolfmeyer hitman incident, as another example. It just doesn't get out much because I genuinely believe there's not as much to get out... and of course if you're not following the sport, you hear about it even less.

NHL players really are that "boring" in most cases though. Mike Commodore made huge waves last year because he tweeted a pic of himself rolling in dollar bills on a bed after signing a new contract. And it was a joke, and everyone knew it. And still it was "controversial" and something people were debating for days and weeks. In the NBA or NFL, that's called "Tuesday" or "Segment #3 on The T.Ocho Show". I'm pretty sure the NHL would have suspended Kobe Bryant for about 50 games for his slur, instead the NBA fined him $10k and told him "NO! BAD KOBE! No go make us some more money in the LA market, and try to not rape anyone this time"... and in the NFL the Mike Danton hit incident would have been met with "PacMan, we told you STOP already...*sigh*". And I can't even begin to figure out how an NFL wide receiver (or anyone period) can get into so much trouble at a mall, so many times, for crying out loud...

Don Cherry spouts off about the stupid Swedes, and he's a Canadian idiot anyways. Every sport has a couple idiots in the media.... hockey's idiots happen to be Cherry, Mike Milbury, and good ol' Pierre "MONSTER" McGuire. It's worth noting all three of these guys are miserably-failed GM's and/or coaches... coincidence? I think not. Those that can coach and GM do, those that can't apparently work for TSN and NBC (or whine about being owed money-- HI WAYNE GRETZKY!).

There's no doubt hockey exists in a sports world outside of the other sports though. And I don't see how that's a bad thing for the sport, personally. It's a plus.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Don Cherry spouts off about the stupid Swedes, and he's a Canadian idiot anyways. Every sport has a couple idiots in the media.... hockey's idiots happen to be Cherry, Mike Milbury, and good ol' Pierre "MONSTER" McGuire.

Who? Are these characters off the wildly popular new rom Tecmo Semi-Pro?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First off I want to get this out there. I feel hockey players are the finest athletes in any sport in the world! Not only do they need to be able to skate almost like a figure skater (meaning they have incredible skill making cuts, accelerate and be nimble in tight spaces) they have to have great endurance (There's a reason no human alive could play all 60 minutes of a game and when hockey games get into deep overtime periods in the postseason it's amazing how they can still have enough in their tanks to finish the game at a high level) while taking a beating every night especially the more finesse guys still are extremely tough. Add to all of that, they use a stick to control a puck while having to avoid other defenders and some of these guys are so accurate it's mind boggling.

I feel hockey is a good fast paced sport but my main thing really goes back to not knowing who the hell every teams enforcer is or who every teams designated power play players are. I've tried to keep up with the movement of the players but around 2002-03 the rookies became less of a feature as in the previous 2 decades. And it's not because a lot of the players I knew were retiring it was honestly in my mind a mistake by the NHL of not letting a fan like me, not casual but not hardcore, of who the next non top but good players were. Like everyone knew about guys like Alexander Ovechkin and Sydney Crosby were because they were hyped up as the new decades stars to carry the league much like Magic and Bird were for basketball. But I never knew of who Steven Stamkos, Duncan Keith, Drew Doughty, Ryan Getzlaf, Shea Weber, Anze Kopitar, Corey Perry, Dan Boyle, Tyler Myers, Jeff Carter or Brad Richards until they had postseason success. (All these names were taken off this list http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature/?id=29790) And it's a damn shame because these guys are not only exciting players but could have played in the 80's or early 90's along side some of those great/good players.

And Primis this is where the hard salary cap comes into the picture. (the NFL and it's hard salary cap and bogus terms for how the money is actually given to players [non guaranteed contracts] sucks and is something I hate about football along with how much money is thrown around with contract lengths and all that) It's a known FACT that dynasties and select other elite teams is what drives interest in professional sports leagues. When a team like the Blackhawks completely have to strip their identity on their roster because they can't afford to keep guys like Dustin Byfuglien, Colin Fraser, John Madden, Ben Eager, Kris Versteeg, Andrew Ladd, Brent Sopel and especially Antti Niemi rather than further improve the team around Kane, Toews, Hossa, Seabrook, Sharp and Keith that's where I have a HUGE problem with the hard cap. They had to fight scratch and claw to get back into the playoffs this year but last year they were the 3rd best teams overall during the regular season! Teams get penalized for building a deep, young talented roster and once guys contracts are up those teams can't resign them and are forced to basically start over when building around their superstars. Because everyone knows you HAVE to pay the big time franchise players if you want to contend and most of the Blackhawks money is invested in Toews, Kane and Hossa. GM's true talents cannot be seen because you constantly have to keep under a salary cap and having built a great team is only good for one season. And fatcheerleader I totally agree with you saying that rookies should be paid less than veterans and is the one big thing right now with the labor talks in football I hope they fix. Those contracts they give to the rookies are ridiculous and the only thing that anyone can argue in favor of those contracts is that the full terms of the length of the contract aren't guaranteed so they "should" be paid higher. That's a totally different subject that we could all discuss (making NFL contracts guaranteed for the entire length but setting a limit to 5 years for players under 27 and 7 for over 27 and a bunch of other stuff) but this is about hockey.

I personally hate parody in pro sports. As much luck is involved in drafting the right players to be able to win, signing free agents and building season after season should be why your a great team. The only true argument to back up a hard cap is that smaller market teams can't contend for the big free agents and that's where another huge problem comes in. THERE ARE TOO MANY TEAMS IN THE LEAGUE!!! When that becomes the reason to prevent dynasties that's where it becomes bullshit. Contracting teams would make everyone else deeper and more talented and you'd have less competition for free agents. But no this will never happen because these sports leagues make more money with more teams and when these smaller cities start whining and crying they can't compete will continue to get babied and allowed to compete.

All of this expansion really hurt the general fan base and then the dead puck era really hurt the product. And when you lose one of the most loyal and dedicated franchises in all of sports in the Hartford Whalers and other great franchises like Winnipeg Jets (the Winnipeg White Out, used now by the Miami Heat, a great fan playoff promotion) and Quebec Nordiques that is just a damn shame. Losing those franchises was due completely to all these new teams coming in and taking those markets that were semi struggling and just crippling them and forcing them to relocate those teams. It's been really hard for the NHL to gain back those fans they lost before the strike in 04-05 even with the new improvements which really bring back what was exciting about the 80's and early 90's.

I honestly am trying to come up with a legit reason why hockey is the inferior sport but I can't. My original response was clearly just a smart ass reply and taking a jab at the general consensus of hockey not being fun to watch. Why do I like basketball more than hockey? It literally is just a preferential choice on my part and the in's and outs to basketball interest me more than hockey. But I can't speak for everyone else who doesn't show interest in hockey.

Like I said in my previous post hockey's mistake is being slotted along side basketball and it gets lost in the shuffle. But honestly where can they fit it in where it can stand out as it clearly being hockey season? Baseball is so long that it takes over half of the years calendar to finish though it's known as a Summer sport, Football a fall sport and basketball a winter sport. If baseball wasn't so long clearly spring would be the season not truly represented by a sport but of course they have spring training so they steal that spotlight. Yes most of these sports overlap another seasonal portion of the year but I guess there has to be one sport in Americans eyes that has to be pushed to the side because another sport is going on during it's season. I personally don't watch baseball until June because during the entire basketball season that's where my focus is. Football is great in that it is a game played on one day and is very easy to follow all the teams and only having one game on Monday and sometimes Thursday really helps. That's what makes football so popular in my perspective is the ease to follow while still keeping up with other sports that go on during it's season; baseball postseason during the early part of the year and basketball and hockey starting up during the mid to late season. If anyone who actually took the time to read this has a good idea when would be the best times of the calendar year for not only hockey but basketball, football and baseball please share as I feel that right there would be a good topic of conversation.

Sorry for the book but I wanted to get my opinion out there

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

shiny, I actually enjoy basketball a lot. Particularly NCAA Basketball. NBA basketball (and even D-League) are terrible, terrible products to watch though. I was a decent Pistons fan for quite a while until the time around their last title when I realized how bad the flow and rules of the game had become. Comparatively speaking, they're akin to the pre-lockout NHL when the trap and obstruction ruled the day.

The Hawks are a terrible example of "parity" ruining the game. The Hawks weren't ruined by parity, they were ruined by absolutely terrible contracts. This was a team that already had serious cap issues ahead, and then went out and signed Marian Hossa. They spent above and beyond what they could afford. They also failed to qualify 3 of their RFA's and were forced to pay out their aft for them (Versteeg, Barker, and another I forget now, who all got around $3m/yr when they would have gotten far less as RFA's). Absolutely terrible cap management. This was not the cap's fault. Had they not signed Hossa, and had they qualified their own RFA's, they likely could have kept that core together and quite frankly might have been able to win a title without Hossa.

For an NBA example, look at the Cleveland Cavaliers. Look at their payroll MINUS Lebron. It's enormous for as untalented as that roster is. That's solely because of poor management and mismanagement.

On the flip side, in the NHL the Detroit Red Wings have been to the playoffs 20 straight years now, 8 Conference Finals, 6 Cup Finals, won 4 of them, and always manage to somehow retool because their front office "gets it" and they flirt with the cap but don't hamstring themselves while also letting their youngsters develop in the minors. The Hard Cap was supposed to KILL Detroit and many writers outside of Detroit said as much. It hasn't. The Hard Cap is NOT any kind of deterrent to prolonged success if you're patient (which most GM's aren't anymore).

As for the Jets... I miss them sometimes. I grew up watching Steen, Housely, and Hawerchuk play for them, and that last team featuring Zhamnov, Selanne, and Tkachuk, with Khabibulin in net (or Bob Essensa even), and remember that it was my Wings that closed out NHL hockey in Winnipeg last time (which oddly enough they might do the same in Phoenix now if the rumors are true). Fact remains they're a small market though and they didn't and couldn't support them financially. If the Coyotes move back to Winnipeg, they'll instantly be the smallest market again by a wide margin. And it will end the same -- the Loonie will fall in value and they'll have to move again. Winnipeg is a good hockey market for sure (as evidences by the success of the IHL-then-AHL Moose).. just not a good NHL market.

I became a Red Wings fan in the early 1980's (when I became old enough to actually watch and understand). Yzerman was just breaking into the league, and Edmonton was revving up their dynasty. I've gone form then (Dead Wings, run-n-gun, dynasties, stand-up goalies)... to the Dead Puck Era (trap, obstruction, huge guys that couldn't skate, acrobatic goalies who could doimate)... until now (more offense post-Lockout, hybrid/butterfly goalies who can be beaten high but take everything away down low, game is so fast concussions and hitting are becoming very dangerous). The East and West are almost two different leagues and rules now (which is a big problem I won't go into, and is why the West dominates the East in the Cup Finals since the lockout), but to be honest there isn't NFL-style parity in the game because the best front offices still dominate: they draft better regardless of how high they pick, they reclaim and develop cast-offs into good players, and they don't mortgage their future for one shot and chance.

To your basketball vs hockey... the idea that one can't follow both is ridiculous in this era of HD, Full Court/Center Ice, internet, video on smartphones, etc. To be honest Detroit is a hodgepodge of fans -- you go to the Joe for a game and you'll see caucasians yes, you'll also see various minorities represented just fine amongst the die hards and season ticket holders and Detroit isn't the only place that's true I know (take Toronto for example). So I don't see an imagined racial barrier unless said individual wants to make it into one -- NBA tickets cost just as much or more than NHL tickets after all. So it's not a "cultural" thing. I just don't get it. And my original statement was true and proven: the NHL has outdrawn (in attendance to venues) the NBA straight up for several seasons now, so people are willing to pay up for the NHL games obviously -- even in markets like LA where they have to go against the Lakers *and* the Clips.

And honestly the NBA is facing the exact same problems as the NHL. For every Phoenix in the NHL, the NBA has a Seattle or Sacramento it seems. For every Florida or Quebec in the NHL, there's a Charlotte in the NBA. For some reason though, nobody sees the similarities and instead harps on the NHL ones, but ignores the NBA's struggles.

I think this next TV contract coming up is huge for the NHL's future. I'm not a huge anti-VERSUS person like a lot of hockey fans, but VERSUS needs to give the NHL more in terms of time, exposure, and households (and unfortunately Comcast owns VERSUS, and Comcast has way too many enemies in their trade). The potential lockouts for the NFL and NBA are huge as well. If the NHL can swing something to get more than one national game on one channel a night (VERSUS2? Turner's also interested... TBS/TNT/TruTV/etc?) you'll see big differences.

And yes, I wrote a book too. Sorry...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Forget NHL vs NBA, we've got Stephen King vs Dean Koontz here! :lol:

And, I just realized I'm late posting my picks but I did it with a co-worker before it started. We aren't doing this for anything anyway so here they are now. Nothing too surprising, all favorites except Montreal and Nashville.

East

Washington over NY Rangers, in 6

Pittsburgh over Tampa Bay, in 6

Montreal over Boston, in 6

Philadelphia over Buffalo, in 5

West

Vancouver over Chicago, in 6

Nashville over Anaheim, in 7

Detroit over Phoenix, in 5

San Jose over Los Angeles, in 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I appreciate the opinions. I'm going to stop debating hockey vs basketball because it's really all about preference. While I do agree that bball has "more" fans, I think hockey fans are true fans and bball fans are more casual....the Jack Nicholson's and Spike Lee's of the world who like to sit, relax and watch a game. When I watch hockey, mainly the Bruins, I don't sit. I pace in front of the tv. Every play is life and death. I don't watch it to relax. Even when the Pats are playing, I can sit and enjoy the game. When you really know the game of hockey, the rules, the strategy, every play is important.

I played basketball for 10 years, ice hockey for only 3, but summer "roller" leagues (that's roller blades, not roller skates :lol: ) pretty much every summer. I can honestly say that there's more strategy to hockey, it's more physical...and you have to be MUCH tougher to play. The fouls in basketball really kill me. Shouldn't guys be allowed to play defense and get a bit physical?

Wait, I thought I said I wasn't going to debate this anymore??

GOD THE BRUINS LOOK AWFUL RIGHT NOW! WILL THOMAS PLEASE MAKE A SAVE??!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BRUINS messed with the wrong team in the regular season, but that being said with Chara coming back you still have a decent chance. Go Nucks!!!!!!!! :lol:

I don't think the B's messed with the wrong team. They are much more talented than Montreal, they are just a bunch of playoff chokers. Julien's system doesn't work in the playoffs and Thomas is a much different goalie in the reg season vs. playoffs.

Vancouver looks real good, though! I'd love to see a VAN vs. DET conf finals. Would be pretty exciting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
... and that last team featuring Zhamnov, Selanne, and Tkachuk, with Khabibulin in net (or Bob Essensa even)

I freaking loved this team!!! Fun to watch and they could play any style against any team. Too bad they never had major success.

While I do agree that bball has "more" fans, I think hockey fans are true fans and bball fans are more casual....the Jack Nicholson's and Spike Lee's of the world who like to sit, relax and watch a game. When I watch hockey, mainly the Bruins, I don't sit. I pace in front of the tv. Every play is life and death. I don't watch it to relax. Even when the Pats are playing, I can sit and enjoy the game. When you really know the game of hockey, the rules, the strategy, every play is important.

Haha, that sounds like me anytime a Heat game is on. My voice is messed up for like the next day or 2 after big games (the last one against the Celtics) and I'm surprised I haven't had a heart attack because I literally get a work out watching games. All I know is I don't have to workout during the postseason when I feel the Heat are real contenders.

It'll be fun to watch some big time hockey when the NBA playoff schedule settles down to like 1 game a day but until than I'll just keep up on the highlights and it'd be nice to finally be able to watch the Bruins late in the season when they had a promising regular season. Last time I got any Bruins satisfaction was when Ray Bourque was traded to Colorado at the deadline to give him a chance in his last year and he finally got his Stanley Cup lap with the trophy. For the record I don't have a favorite team but if I had to choose one it'd be Boston or Hartford Whalers :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Haha, that sounds like me anytime a Heat game is on. My voice is messed up for like the next day or 2 after big games (the last one against the Celtics) and I'm surprised I haven't had a heart attack because I literally get a work out watching games. All I know is I don't have to workout during the postseason when I feel the Heat are real contenders.

A slew of Red Wings fans like to congregate online at a blog called Abel to Yzerman. Every year when the playoffs roll around, the gameday liveblog threads get huge (1000+ posts a game) and it's called "Riding the Hasek" because if you ever watched Dominik Hasek as your team's goalie in an important game, you'd know what a roller-coaster it is. Most thread end with various individuals posting things like "I hate the Hasek" and "The Hasek makes me fetal every time". Most of them get through it by drinking their way through the game (which results in entertaining posts towards the end of games, if they're intelligible still anyways).

Playoff hockey is so tough as a fan anyways. In a close game (or worse an OT game) you clinch up your body and literally stress out as a fan. Every shot on goal against is your demise, every shot on goal your team takes is your salvation. In Game 2 of the Wings-'yotes the Wings were up 4-0 and I still couldn't not stress because I knew the refs would get the 'yotes back into it (because that's how playoff hockey works). So my team is up 4 goals in the 2nd and I'm sitting here with my stomach churning anyways... there is no safe haven.

I remember watching the entire PIT-PHI 5 OT game some years ago and by the 3rd or 4th OT you would have thought one of those teams was mine. Resistance to a game like that is futile for a hockey fan, whether your team is involved or not. I totally remember that when Primeau scored on that otherwise-innocent-seeming shot I raised my arms and let out a little cheer. Gotta' love playoff hockey.

I'll be an absolute wreck by 10:30pm tonight when Game 3 starts. God I hate being a Eastern Time Zone team in the Western Conference... if any of you are in Pacific or Mountain Time maybe you can tell me, but can any of you guys fathom having to stay up until 10pm or 10:30pm to watch your team play until 1am (or far worse if it goes OT)?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
For the record I don't have a favorite team but if I had to choose one it'd be Boston or Hartford Whalers :lol:

I miss the Whalers! Pat Verbeek. Kevin Dineen. Ron Francis. Chris Pronger was actually drafted by Hartford.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I remember watching the entire PIT-PHI 5 OT game some years ago and by the 3rd or 4th OT you would have thought one of those teams was mine. Resistance to a game like that is futile for a hockey fan, whether your team is involved or not. I totally remember that when Primeau scored on that otherwise-innocent-seeming shot I raised my arms and let out a little cheer. Gotta' love playoff hockey.

I'll be an absolute wreck by 10:30pm tonight when Game 3 starts. God I hate being a Eastern Time Zone team in the Western Conference... if any of you are in Pacific or Mountain Time maybe you can tell me, but can any of you guys fathom having to stay up until 10pm or 10:30pm to watch your team play until 1am (or far worse if it goes OT)?

I remember this game very well. My dad is a Flyers fan and we stayed up to watch it.

And I'm pretty used to staying up until midnight - 1pm as it is. At the very least I'll go grab a large ice coffee to make it through!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And I'm pretty used to staying up until midnight - 1pm as it is. At the very least I'll go grab a large ice coffee to make it through!

I used to be able to, but... I'm too old for that stuff. I freely admit it. I used to work until 1:30 am then turn around and go back in to work 4 hours later, and stuff like that. Now.... 10pm rolls around and I'm thinking "Man, sleep sounds good". A 1 year-old doesn't help that either...

I'll be up at 10:30pm trying to stay up as long as i can. My bet is that sometime around the start of the 2nd I'll say "Screw it" and go to bed... I fail to see why 6:30pm local start times are unacceptable on the west coast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Caps got there ass handed to them last night. I knew NY wouldn't go away easily.

Ass handed to them? NY got a lucky goal with a minute left...

I know, I get that, they just seemed flat to me and seemed to not be hustling for lack of a better term. They never seem to be all on when they need to be. And, it seems that the offense can't seem to find their rhythm. I like how defense is the new theme with the Caps but they just don't seem to get after on offense like they did in the past. Semin kills me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I used to be able to, but... I'm too old for that stuff. I freely admit it. I used to work until 1:30 am then turn around and go back in to work 4 hours later, and stuff like that. Now.... 10pm rolls around and I'm thinking "Man, sleep sounds good". A 1 year-old doesn't help that either...

I'll be up at 10:30pm trying to stay up as long as i can. My bet is that sometime around the start of the 2nd I'll say "Screw it" and go to bed... I fail to see why 6:30pm local start times are unacceptable on the west coast.

I'm in the same boat actually. My daughter is 1 & 1/2 this month....and I'm 31 which I consider old. Most nights by 10pm I'm completely exhausted considering I'm up at 5:30 every morning. I make exceptions for football and hockey. Trust me though, there's some Friday nights were I'm lights out at 8pm.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Caps got there ass handed to them last night. I knew NY wouldn't go away easily.

Ass handed to them? NY got a lucky goal with a minute left...

I know, I get that, they just seemed flat to me and seemed to not be hustling for lack of a better term. They never seem to be all on when they need to be. And, it seems that the offense can't seem to find their rhythm. I like how defense is the new theme with the Caps but they just don't seem to get after on offense like they did in the past. Semin kills me.

First game of the series in NY, you gotta expect that. The Rangers came out flying...as most teams do (except the Bruins). Caps in 5...maybe 6.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A slew of Red Wings fans like to congregate online at a blog called Abel to Yzerman. Every year when the playoffs roll around, the gameday liveblog threads get huge (1000+ posts a game) and it's called "Riding the Hasek" because if you ever watched Dominik Hasek as your team's goalie in an important game, you'd know what a roller-coaster it is. Most thread end with various individuals posting things like "I hate the Hasek" and "The Hasek makes me fetal every time". Most of them get through it by drinking their way through the game (which results in entertaining posts towards the end of games, if they're intelligible still anyways).

Great names for the blog and the gameday liveblog threads! If I wasn't so damn superstitious and thought I could get away with publicly talking trash about my teams opponent I'd be all about doing something like this. I can only imagine how entertaining this is, especially to a non-diehard Wings fan just happening to stumble across it. Gotta love being part of a fanbase that has many true diehard fans and are very passionate about your teams. It makes you feel a little more sane when you see other people acting 10 times worse than you when you hear from your family members that you overreact to much and them telling you that they can't hear you through the tv. :lol:

BRUINS!

We got ourselves a fahkin' series!

:lol: Gotta fahkin' love the New Englander slang!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

lovin the whaler's fans. i thought i was the only one.

I don't think the B's messed with the wrong team. They are much more talented than Montreal, they are just a bunch of playoff chokers. Julien's system doesn't work in the playoffs and Thomas is a much different goalie in the reg season vs. playoffs.

i have to disagree with you on this point. When nucks played the bruins this year we were playing at full energy (minus edler) and were beaten by a team that over powered us. adding insult to injury late in the season helped fire up a very passionate team. cammalleri, price and suban are very emotional players. i can't comment on Julien's system but you have a team that could still go very deep.

Vancouver looks real good, though! I'd love to see a VAN vs. DET in conf finals. Would be pretty exciting.

ya best games of year for us when we meet the wings.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Stupid Canucks and Kings getting lazy... brooms need to come out in PHX tonight. Skate to the throat Wings, skate to the throat...

I'm really hoping for a VAN/DET series. That would be one hell of Western Conf Finals.

SJ/LA was a great game. Ugly, but exciting.

Yesterday, the NHL signed its most-lucrative TV contract ever with NBC/VERSUS. That combined with a newish beer deal means the league will have a lot more money to play with next season.

I like it.

Why do people bash Versus anyways? It's right next to the NFL Network for me, seems like a prime spot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×