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Bodom

RS and MS values?

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I have a few questions regarding RS/RP/MS for both offensive and defensive players that I’m hoping someone here can shed some light on. With all the knowledgeable guys here, I’m sure this will be answered, no problem.

My reasoning for this is to be able to create my own edit for Yak’s Tecmo Super Coach – with no disrespect to YakMolester. I believe his coaching rom and all the ideas associated with it are just pure genius down to the very last detail, and I think I’ve told him 25-30 times he’s probably sick of hearing it. I have recently spent numerous hours going through every player on this rom and editing them (based on Yak’s number range) using a combination of Yak’s ratings then tweaking them based on my football knowledge, their individual season stats and the team’s season stats. I think I pretty much have it perfected (to my liking anyways). Elway7 has a copy – he can say if it sucks or not.

The one major change between my edits to Yak’s original are (for RB’s, WR’s and TE’s) a Decreased RS and RP and increased MS. But not by much. To me, the game lacked that break away speed excitement. While it was more difficult for a player to actually get a step on the defense, once they get past the defenders, they are not easily caught adding some realism to the game. Again, I understand Yak had a method to his madness and I’m not taking away from that. Just my own personal preference when it comes to player speeds.

Anyways, on to my questions.

When it comes to RS and MS – I have read conflicting points of view on these values. Just wanted to clear the air. I understand what the values are, but I have read these two opinions:

1. If a player has a RS of 63 and a MS of 50, he will start at 63 and decrease to 50 as the play develops.

2. An RS of 63 is = MS of 19, RS 69 = MS 25, etc… So in this case, if a player has RS of 63 (MS 19), he would start at 63 (MS 19), and INCREASE to MS 50, based on the staggered values.

Which is correct?

My second question is, do offensive MS values and defensive MS values equal? I have read that the MS of a defender is RP + MS (with higher acceleration based on RP). Also tested this out and it seems dead on accurate. So, understanding that defensive players have certain boots (I’m sure we have all experienced catching up to a guy from 50+ yards back), and not taking those into consideration…is it safe to assume that if an offensive with MS of 69 would have the same maximum speed as a defender with RP 56, MS 13? I guess with Yak’s rom and the removal of the defensive boots (another genius idea) it would be the same??

If anyone could offer any input on this, it would be greatly appreciated!!

*Also, I apologize for not listing the authors of these articles that I read, I was jotting them down as notes one day and totally forgot where I had seen them, but could possibly find them if needed.

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I believe that Defensive MS is MS + 100.

I think of RS as 'initial speed' and RP as 'acceleration to MS'. And because of the 69 RP, most guys are already at MS once they hit the line of scrimmage. Changing things from 69 will change the 'feel' of the game, but if you're doing this for a COACH rom, who cares how it feels?

There used to be a spreadsheet that bruddog posted which calculated "distances and tecmo time" for RS/RP/MS ratings. When I get home I'll try to find my copy of it.

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Go, go, go! I am always interested in the creations of others (or modifications, as it may be). Go, bro, go!

You are my inspiration, bro! :lol:

By the way, I've seen your TSC2 thread and am putting some ideas together.

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I believe that Defensive MS is MS + 100.

I think of RS as 'initial speed' and RP as 'acceleration to MS'. And because of the 69 RP, most guys are already at MS once they hit the line of scrimmage. Changing things from 69 will change the 'feel' of the game, but if you're doing this for a COACH rom, who cares how it feels?

There used to be a spreadsheet that bruddog posted which calculated "distances and tecmo time" for RS/RP/MS ratings. When I get home I'll try to find my copy of it.

Buck, just to clarify...I have changed the RP values drastically. Actually a notch lower than Yak's originals. My top RB's for example are 38, 25, 50 (Williams, Peterson). And I fully understand the initial speed, acceleration and max speed. Darren Sproles for example is 31, 6, 56. He remains at 31 for a good % of his run, but if he breaks loose, he's gone. Thus far, this only happens maybe 1 out of 20-25 runs. The 56 MS is deceiving with the low RP. RB with higher RS and RP are more effective.

I guess what I am trying to accomplish is offensive players not being able to juke out every defender on the field (like the original), but once they break free, are tougher to chase down.

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I guess what I am trying to accomplish is offensive players not being able to juke out every defender on the field (like the original), but once they break free, are tougher to chase down.

Have you tried setting all defenders to 6 MS? Even though, I've heard that defensive max speed is MS + 100 (so MS basically doesn't matter). So, chase-downs may be unavoidable unless that max speed (+100 thing) of defenders is internally modified. Unfortunately, I don't know where that value(s) resides...

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I guess what I am trying to accomplish is offensive players not being able to juke out every defender on the field (like the original), but once they break free, are tougher to chase down.

Have you tried setting all defenders to 6 MS? Even though, I've heard that defensive max speed is MS + 100 (so MS basically doesn't matter). So, chase-downs may be unavoidable unless that max speed (+100 thing) of defenders is internally modified. Unfortunately, I don't know where that value(s) resides...

Currently, my MS values on defense are DL (6), LB (6-19), DB (13-19). The MS +100 info does help though...thanks! I guess this answers my "how does offensive MS compare to defense MS" question.

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First question:

#1 is wrong. #2 is correct.

Second question:

Defensive MS= Offsenive MS+100 ratings points.

Another way to think of that is that a 6MS defender would have a slightly higher top speed than a 100MS offensive player.

When it comes to RS and MS – I have read conflicting points of view on these values. Just wanted to clear the air. I understand what the values are, but I have read these two opinions:

1. If a player has a RS of 63 and a MS of 50, he will start at 63 and decrease to 50 as the play develops.

2. An RS of 63 is = MS of 19, RS 69 = MS 25, etc… So in this case, if a player has RS of 63 (MS 19), he would start at 63 (MS 19), and INCREASE to MS 50, based on the staggered values.

Which is correct?

My second question is, do offensive MS values and defensive MS values equal? I have read that the MS of a defender is RP + MS (with higher acceleration based on RP). Also tested this out and it seems dead on accurate.

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First question:

#1 is wrong. #2 is correct.

Second question:

Defensive MS= Offsenive MS+100 ratings points.

Another way to think of that is that a 6MS defender would have a slightly higher top speed than a 100MS offensive player.

When it comes to RS and MS – I have read conflicting points of view on these values. Just wanted to clear the air. I understand what the values are, but I have read these two opinions:

1. If a player has a RS of 63 and a MS of 50, he will start at 63 and decrease to 50 as the play develops.

2. An RS of 63 is = MS of 19, RS 69 = MS 25, etc… So in this case, if a player has RS of 63 (MS 19), he would start at 63 (MS 19), and INCREASE to MS 50, based on the staggered values.

Which is correct?

My second question is, do offensive MS values and defensive MS values equal? I have read that the MS of a defender is RP + MS (with higher acceleration based on RP). Also tested this out and it seems dead on accurate.

Gotcha! It may take a while for this to sink in as I was under the impression that #1 was correct, but it will definitely help when rating roms. Thank you, bruddog!

*EDIT* I'm assuming the same +100 formula doesn't apply to RS as it does to MS...? My years of playing tells me no, but I just want to be sure.

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How about CPU controlled QB scrambles? With the exception of a few, most of my QB's are set at 19, 6, 6. It seems that a QB is much faster when they scramble on a pass play as opposed to a QB run play. I put a QB run play in the other night to test this out and never ran for more than 10 yards. Some of my scrambles on pass plays were 30-35 yards. This is on COA mode, not MAN.

Could this possibly be similar to the PR Max Speed = to that of the RT type thing, or is my mind just playing tricks on me? Anyone ever tested this out or notice this?

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How about CPU controlled QB scrambles? With the exception of a few, most of my QB's are set at 19, 6, 6. It seems that a QB is much faster when they scramble on a pass play as opposed to a QB run play. I put a QB run play in the other night to test this out and never ran for more than 10 yards. Some of my scrambles on pass plays were 30-35 yards. This is on COA mode, not MAN.

Could this possibly be similar to the PR Max Speed = to that of the RT type thing, or is my mind just playing tricks on me? Anyone ever tested this out or notice this?

some CPU scramble code has RP and MS boosts. that's what you're seeing.

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How about CPU controlled QB scrambles? With the exception of a few, most of my QB's are set at 19, 6, 6. It seems that a QB is much faster when they scramble on a pass play as opposed to a QB run play. I put a QB run play in the other night to test this out and never ran for more than 10 yards. Some of my scrambles on pass plays were 30-35 yards. This is on COA mode, not MAN.

Could this possibly be similar to the PR Max Speed = to that of the RT type thing, or is my mind just playing tricks on me? Anyone ever tested this out or notice this?

some CPU scramble code has RP and MS boosts. that's what you're seeing.

Makes sense. Kind of.

Is this something specific to QB's, which play, ........?

I'm assuming there's a way to turn this off?

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